The Michigan Messenger - Latest Comments in Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

HANK4 — Tue, 23 Sep 2008 12:40:10 -0000

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Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

HANK4 — Tue, 23 Sep 2008 01:21:23 -0000

Rayne1
It seems that most of my post got lost in the ether. I try again.
HANK4

Rayne1
> You read it: "Messenger rejects GOP plea for retraction."
>
> Neither Michigan Messenger nor its parent organization, the Center for Independent Media, have received a formal request for retraction from the MIGOP, RNC, or James Carabelli as of today.
>
>
>
I note that your link is dated 9/12/08 and only refers to one of two issues in my link. My link and the below article from your site, I believe, addresses the first issue which was retracted by Michigan Messenger's parent and are dated a week later.
Further, your article providing the credentials of your reporter and her long history of unbiased professionalism seems overtaken by the articles she has written as seen on your home page and the fact that she got at least half of the foreclosure caging apparently wrong.

Messenger clarifies Ohio official’s remark
By Jefferson Morley 9/19/08 5:48 PM

Michigan Messenger received a letter yesterday from Douglas J. Preisse, chairman of the Franklin County Republican Party in Columbus Ohio, disputing Eartha Melzer’s summary of remarks he made to a local newspaper about voter challenges.
Citing an article in the Columbus Dispatch, Melzer had reported in her story “Lose your house, lose your vote” that Priesse [...]

Why could I not get this whole article on your web site?

Don't you think that you should update your bloggers on your parent companies position?
> If you are unable to type in mixed case, please use lower case instead of upper case as upper case denotes shouting. If you are indeed shouting, this is not in compliance with our site's comment policy; future shouting risks being deleted without notice.

I apologize for the caps as I thought it was acceptable as seen in other posts to this thread.
I assume that you corrected those posters as well.

HANK4

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

Rayne1 — Mon, 22 Sep 2008 23:54:56 -0000

Hank4: this is the official statement of this site:

http://michiganmessenger.com/4313/messenger-rej...

You read it: "Messenger rejects GOP plea for retraction."

Neither Michigan Messenger nor its parent organization, the Center for Independent Media, have received a formal request for retraction from the MIGOP, RNC, or James Carabelli as of today.

If you are unable to type in mixed case, please use lower case instead of upper case as upper case denotes shouting. If you are indeed shouting, this is not in compliance with our site's comment policy; future shouting risks being deleted without notice.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

HANK4 — Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:54:48 -0000

http://blog.mlive.com/chronicle/2008/09/michiga...

MI MSSG RETRACTS-READ IT!!

I BET YOU WILL NOT APOLOGIZE BUT WILL WIGGLE ALONG WITH "THE ONE"!

SOCIALISM IS COMING. WRIGHT/PFLAGER/REZKO/AYERS/DORNE SLEEPING IN THE WHITE HOUSE??

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

HANK4 — Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:49:41 -0000

http://blog.mlive.com/chronicle/2008/09/michiga...

MI MSSG RETRACTS-READ IT!

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

HANK4 — Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:46:58 -0000

http://blog.mlive.com/chronicle/2008/09/michiga...

MI Mssg retracts!!!!
Read it!

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

abbey — Sun, 21 Sep 2008 11:05:08 -0000

Well, it makes sense. To ensure the kind of voters this country needs we must look to property owners, people with sound financial management skills - and by the way whatever happened to the idea of introducing a poll tax? Or only allowing people with an income above $250,000, or disqualifying women... That should knock off any number of undesireable voters and if it's run correctly, this scheme could be designed to eliminate any number of Obama supporters.
Sarcasam asice, I was so sure that this would be the Democrats' year - but the closeness of the polls challenge this! Why are people so quick to accept this blatent attack on democracy?

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

alscheck — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 22:20:51 -0000

I can't help but comment again as a reminder of what they did in the south to keep black voters away from the poles. What in God's name will the republicanas try next. God help us.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

alscheck — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 22:19:24 -0000

This is the most disgusting thing I've seen yet. I live in Florida so it just comes home as to the 2000 and 2004 elections where we were cheated. Disgusting. I hope Obama can get it stopped. The Republicans will do ANYTHING to win, since they can't win by the vote of the people.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

stinkysmom — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:45:33 -0000

this unAmerican tactic is nothing BUT biased and hatefull.
are we to just hand this country over to the rich white man? anyone actually BEEN to this neighborhood? this is robbing human beings of the homes they live in WITH THEIR FAMILIES AND YES THAT INCLUDES CHILDREN and then it strips them of their ability to change a system that has failed them.

and as far as "letting them fry"? what do you mean? in HELL? yeah, that sounds great, but what will that do for our contry in the mean time?

and justjohn, i respect that you're trying to view this from both sides. you're giving it a good shot so kudos to you. i myself have been a conservative republican since 1984, but 5 years ago i decided to let go of the bias and REALLY view it from all angles.... i became a better person.

and lets face it kids, if Barack Obama was a white man?... he'd be 20 points ahead in the polls.
and THAT'S what's WRONG with this country.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

justjohn123 — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:02:11 -0000

This whole article is about nothing. If a person can still vote in their precinct for 60 days, then as of the 4th of this moth the letter really becomes useless right.

I have no doubt that either party would stoop as low as they could to win the election. In the end we vote someone in to office but we are the only ones who loose.

I understand your point about inplied facts. I see them spread on every news station everyday. I wish we could get beyond all of the silly he said-she said / he did-she did manuvering and get to the point of this election. Which one of these jokers is actually going to do something positive for this country?

The media and the parties want the public mired in the crap so that we don't have time to really look at the facts. The facts are that both of these guys have some good things they want to do but they also have some (my opinion) very bad ideas for this country. I may be a conservative but I can't say that McCain has really done anything to earn my vote.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

TheBlackEuropean — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 09:57:21 -0000

This is a new low. I don't have the words, I'm speechless. What, are we back in the 19th century? Dickensian England? These tactics come right out of Stalinist Russia or Hitler Germany! Wait, let me get this straight:
First, the Repukes promote a Wild West housing market, giving everyone a loan who made minimum wage.
Second, now that these Repuke policies have killed a 150 year old respectable Jewish monument, they not only wanna kick those people out of their own homes, but wanna take away their voting rights TOO?
Un EFFING believable!!!

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

sunshine55 — Thu, 18 Sep 2008 08:57:11 -0000

I would like to flood Governor Jennifer M. Granholm and Michigan Secretary of State, Republican Terri Lynn Land's offices with letters of concern and protest against the proposed caging practices directed at Michigan residents that have lost thier homes due to foreclosure.

To Join the cause, your letters can be sent to:
Governor Jennifer M. Granholm
P.O. Box 30013
Lansing, Michigan 48909
PHONE: (517) 373-3400
PHONE: (517) 335-7858 - Constituent Services
and
SE Michigan Office
3022 W. Grand Blvd.
Cadillac Place, Suite 14-150
Detroit, MI 48202
(313) 456-0010

Michigan Secretary of State, Republican Terri Lynn
Info@terrilynnland.com

Example letter:

Dr. Ms Granholm/ Land,
I am a registered Michigan voter and am opposed to the caging practices proposed against Michigan voters that have lost homes due to foreclosure. You must stop this unacceptable practice now.

Thank you,
(Your name and address)

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

manitoumackinac — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 20:31:17 -0000

People do that all the time. It's called an Absentee ballot. It's voter fraud if a person votes twice or if votes were fabricated or dismissed. Members of the Armed forces do absentee ballots this all the time, even if they haven't set foot in their home state for many years. People who have many residences, like summer and winter homes, wealthy individuals with many homes and even members of congress do this.

Residence is a somewhat arbitrary concept when it comes to voting. As long as they don't vote twice, like in two different states, then whats the real harm?

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

addicuss — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:10:06 -0000

justjohn youre a typical republican. It frightens me the way you react and respond to this. and it saddens me that its so common in republicans (and in americans). facts can be shoved down your throat all day and night and you will either refuse to believe them or even acknowledge them.

Facts of the story are very cut and dry. In michigan you can lose your home and still vote from your OLD precinct for 60 days. In michigan you can reside at your home even after foreclosure. Republicans mailed letters out in an attempt to challenge voters who were foreclosed on. There are very few reasons to do this as there are other measures in place to stop voter fraud.

Your first argument was that this is a valid noble tactic to stop voter fraud.There are very few reasons to do this as there are other measures in place to stop voter fraud. But lets believe for a minute that the gop is really doing this to stop voter fraud. why target voters who were foreclosed on? and is it not suspicious to you in the slightest that these people are also likely democrats (not to mention poor). No matter what party you are this is something you should be angry about.

your next trick is implying that Democrats would stoop as low as republicans to win an election. True or not does this really justify the tactic? What difference does this make. If I stab someone to death does it make me less wrong than the guy that shot someone to death?

Then you dismissively say you shouldnt vote in a precinct you dont live in. which has been pointed out several times is perfectly legal for 60 days

Well then you imply that this wouldn't even affect democrats more than republicans by saying we're acting like only low income democrats get foreclosed on (completely irrelevant.. not to mention the fact you directly contradicted yourself in saying "Do you think Obama is suing for your rights? He wouldn't care at all (and neither would the GOP for that matter) if those votes weren't statistically in his favor.")

well when thats shot down you go back to "Wouldn't it be voter fraud if a person voted in a pricinct that he/she did not live in" which for the last time.. IS NOT TRUE FOR 60 DAYS IT IS ONLY FRAUD IF THEY VOTE IN TWO PRECINCTS.

I have no doubt if this were a story about democrats disenfranchising republicans you would be parading around here shouting that obama is just more of the same.

It boggles me. Youre arguing nothing. Youre arguing it with nothing. You imply but never name your points. after all its much more convenient to imply something and have people make their own conclusions, conclusions that most americans dont bother to fact check because the implication is so sly its almost like youre outright SAYING something. Dont say obama is a muslim, but imply it every chance you get, dont say that obama is a terrorist but imply terrorists are often muslims and let people make the logical fallacy that the reverse is true. imply imply imply. Obscure facts. Point to the other guy. but whatever you do NEVER, NEVER EVER look at the issue, and address the facts of the issue. Its the republican way.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

justjohn123 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:50:21 -0000

I think I got the point. They mail a do not forward letter to the foreclosed residence. If it is returned, then the adress is disqualified. However, they still have a 60 day grace period.

Did I miss anything?

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

addicuss — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:50:12 -0000

ugh

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

justjohn123 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:43:39 -0000

You nailed the question on the head. Who does it help or hinder? I'm sure somebody from the GOP would be crying about this if the tables were turned. I'm sure it's no mystery to you that I am a conservative but you believe that I have some sort of bias or hate. It's not that at all. If this practice is deemed wrong then let them fry for their actions.

In reality, I'm not sure I want to trust the decision on leadership of this country to someone who didn't understand that an adjustable rate mortgage was a bad idea. I'm not excusing the banks but each of these people has to take a certain amount of responsibility for their actions.

You are right this probably does target one demographic over another. The Michigan law states that they are allowed to vote in the existing precinct for 60 days after they leave. Doesn't that make this a non issue? If they were still in their home on the fourth of September, then they can vote where they were.

Please don't assume I am full of hate and judgment.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

manitoumackinac — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:52:12 -0000

I personally condemn any of these practices regardless of the party involved. I'm not naieve enough to think that this doesn't happen the other way with the democrats. In this case it appears that the GOP got caught with it's hand in the cookie jar.

Some principals transcend party affiliation, the right to vote should be a very sensitive issue for everyone. It's very wise to have the mindset that it's always going to be under attack, and not dismiss anything.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

j4kp07 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:43:01 -0000

lol...your so full of hate. and judgment too I'm sure.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

its4marsha — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:40:39 -0000

If your are telling the truth, for the people and believe in the people...why is there a need to scheme and hustle to win? It is so unbelievable that the Reepers are willing to cheat and lie and say it is for the good of the people. I think if you are in a foreclosure situation in any state, you might want to know the rules. You have time to get it strainght...mosts states have a deadline of October 6, 2008. Let all stay in formed!

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

j4kp07 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:38:41 -0000

justjohn123...you've missed several points and the BIG picture. 1) the mailings are marked "do not forward" (this shows an intention of not wanting to actually contact the resident with further instructions to assist them...how's that for morals and integrity). 2) the Michigan law provides for a 60-day "buffer"

and the BIG picture...any non-biased person would agree that this unfairly targets the lower/middle class and I would even be willing to bet a week's paycheck that the letters also target a certain demographic within certain districts.

also...the assertion here is to protect against voter fraud. so does this tactic help ( (i.e. prevent double voting) or does it hender (i.e. blacklist legitimate voters).

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

lkellar55 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:12:00 -0000

I wish I didn't agree with you.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

lkellar55 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:07:48 -0000

John I think you've missed the point that they will disqualify voters who use the address listed in their foreclosure records whether or not the resident is still in the home. Luckily the law seems still to be on the side of the people and this plan will not work.

But this does make the trargetted foreclosure scheme look even more like it was orchestrated with this in mind.

Re: Obama campaign files suit over foreclosure lists

justjohn123 — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:41:11 -0000

Please don't act like both parties aren't looking for every possible avenue to secure this election. Do you think Obama is suing for your rights? He wouldn't care at all (and neither would the GOP for that matter) if those votes weren't statistically in his favor.